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Grape vines

Post by CanuckBob on Thu May 10, 2018 2:08 pm

Does anyone know a nursery around here where I can buy some grapevines?? Preferably purple wine grapes like concords.

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Re: Grape vines

Post by CHILLIN on Thu May 10, 2018 2:28 pm

That is interesting. I knew there are fields of concord grapes, up in the "missions" area of Mexico. It was, and still is used as a sacrament wine By Jewish and Catholic faiths. They were introduced to Mexico, and California by Father Serra in the 1700's. They are called Mission Grapes.
They sell seeds for them on the internet.
http://www.specialtyproduce.com/produce/Mission_Grapes_11094.php

If you are up to a road trip, here are the five missions of the Sierra Gorda area of Guanajuato.
https://www.worldheritagesite.org/list/Franciscan+Missions+in+the+Sierra+Gorda
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Re: Grape vines

Post by CanuckBob on Thu May 10, 2018 2:46 pm

Yes, I have found seeds on amazon but was hoping for some that were a little further along...haha.

I have seen roadside vendors around here selling green grape vines but of course you don't see them when you want them.

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Re: Grape vines

Post by slainte39 on Thu May 10, 2018 4:13 pm

Maybe Brigitte will weigh in, as that relates to the sort of thing that was her earlier life's work.
Aguascalientes was the nearest vineyards of any consequence that I remember.

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Re: Grape vines

Post by Trailrunner on Thu May 10, 2018 4:24 pm

You're looking for starts, right? Are you looking for table grape plants or wine grapes?

If you want to make wine, take a cool trip up to Valle de Guadalupe in northern Baja. It's the Napa Valley of Mexico. There are restaurants that do local food and wine pairings and I hear they are outstanding. Decide what wine you want to grow and ask the winery or check viveros in the area.
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Re: Grape vines

Post by brigitte on Thu May 10, 2018 4:36 pm

You will not get good advice from me, Concord grapes mae some of the worst wine you can get...I would not touch the stuff/// I do not know what the Catholics use in the US but I can tell you the Europeans do not use it. ..
I would think good Europeen wine varieties would be prone to mildew here and other diseases so you would have to spray a lot..also the vines would not go dormant here and if they did not for very long so that would not be too good for the quality of the wine. You could always try it and see what happens but I feel the weather is not right.. not enough cold weather, too much rain when the fruit is growing.. but who knows.. Concord would work better as it is more resistant but it is an acquired taste....

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Re: Grape vines

Post by RoyD on Thu May 10, 2018 7:46 pm

I am told by the "in the know" people (I am not in the know), that muscat grapes are the best for wine making and also make fine table grapes. Do not know whether you can get those down there.

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Re: Grape vines

Post by brigitte on Thu May 10, 2018 8:13 pm

Sounds like the" in the know" is used very loosely there.. Muscat is not considered a one of the bestgrapes. Muscatis white and Canuck Bob was mentioning red. Muscat is usually fruity and sweet but the Alsatians make a nuce dry muscat that can be very nice with Chinese good.
There is no such a thing as a best grape for wine..all grapes are different and the best is the one you like best.. Beer

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Re: Grape vines

Post by Gamina on Thu May 10, 2018 11:14 pm

Muscats make wonderful raisins. A really different flavor.
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Re: Grape vines

Post by cypress on Fri May 11, 2018 6:41 am

I bought both red and green grape vines at the nursery in San Juan Cosala.

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Re: Grape vines

Post by CanuckBob on Fri May 11, 2018 7:30 am

Thanks, I will check them out. Where exactly in SJC are they?

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Re: Grape vines

Post by brigitte on Fri May 11, 2018 8:13 am

yes wonderful flavor for raisins and table grapes, not the most subtle for wine but I think the dry muscat is interesting with certain foods as well.. the heavy sweet wines are not to my liking unless they are like some of the great German wines or Sauternes..


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Re: Grape vines

Post by brigitte on Fri May 11, 2018 8:20 am

the rootstock is very important on grape vines.. The stock for the America is phylloxera resistant so no problem except for the Pierce desease but the European grapes are not phylloxera resistant and eventually get it..All European grapes in northern America are grafted on rootstock that is resistant. After the Phylloxera epidemic all vineyards of European grapes were wiped out so they were planted with local rootstock and grafted.. then Davis U developed a new resistant rootstock that produced more.. *before they figured less was better( so many vineyard and new vineyards were planted with that rootstock and 30 years later the vineyards started dying from the phylloxera so the growers had to replant and graft again.. Nature is funny that way..

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Re: Grape vines

Post by Trailrunner on Fri May 11, 2018 8:28 am

So, cypress, how are your grapes doing? How long have you been growing them and which grapes are you growing.

I agree with Brigitte, I think our climate is not suitable but who knows. I've been growing organic produce for about five years and it ain't easy! Between the whitefly, viruses, bugs, aphids, mold, rain, heat, etc 

Looking for to following your project CB.
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Re: Grape vines

Post by CanuckBob on Fri May 11, 2018 8:46 am

They grow grapes in other areas around Mexico (Baja, Sonora, Guanajuato) so no reason they shouldn't grow here. I have no intention of making wine. I want to eat them......

http://www.freshplaza.com/article/116078/Mexico-Sonoras-table-grape-production-hits-17-million-boxes

http://winefolly.com/review/an-overview-of-mexican-wine-country/

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Re: Grape vines

Post by CanuckBob on Fri May 11, 2018 9:14 am

Btw.......this in the arbor I am building out of my old roof beams. Hopefully it will be hanging with grapes......jaja.



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Re: Grape vines

Post by tonyburton on Fri May 11, 2018 10:08 am

Grapes have certainly been grown in Ajijic in the past. There is a great photo in Life Magazine from 1957 of a couple enjoying grapes from their arbor, and I believe the Posada Ajijic (the old one) had [maybe still has?] a very large grape vine near the original entrance. Photos of Neill James's property fifty years ago also suggest she had a flourishing grape vine in her yard. How times have changed!

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Re: Grape vines

Post by thomashellyer on Fri May 11, 2018 11:39 am

There is already and will soon be TONS more wine being grown and produced around Lake Chapala, at this point mostly on the south shore. This article is in Spanish from Feb of this year, lots of money being invested in winery industry: https://www.informador.mx/Jalisco-innova-en-el-cultivo-de-uva-producen-vino-en-la-Ribera-de-Chapala-l201802210001.html

Bob, hope you can find some good grape vines...

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Re: Grape vines

Post by CanuckBob on Fri May 11, 2018 11:45 am

Great news. Thanks Thomas & Tony.

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Re: Grape vines

Post by CanuckBob on Fri May 11, 2018 12:41 pm

My son is a brewology professor at a university in Vancouver. I guess I should be growing hops and set up a micro brewery........jaja. Unfortunately they won't grow here.

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Re: Grape vines

Post by brigitte on Fri May 11, 2018 3:52 pm

and good wine will not be made from grapes growing here, I can assure that no matter what Tony and others found about the past..
By the way Bob there is a harbour in the hacienda Parador Santa Maria bear Tinataria Chiapas that is growing awine with incredible flowers but you need a harbour to grown them as the flowers drop underneath.. I am going back in July I will see of I cn find out what they are but they are stunning.. THe climate thereis similar to what we have here so you could grown that vine for sure and would not have to keep spraying for plaga..

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Re: Grape vines

Post by brigitte on Fri May 11, 2018 3:58 pm

here is the link to the picture gallery , the flowers are yellow and red.. I have not seen them here but I bet some people will recognize them
https://www.paradorsantamaria.com.mx/galeria/

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Grapevines

Post by cypress on Fri May 11, 2018 4:42 pm

Trailrunner wrote:So, cypress, how are your grapes doing? How long have you been growing them and which grapes are you growing.

I planted them about 7 years ago. They are long since dead and gone.

I agree with Brigitte, I think our climate is not suitable but who knows. I've been growing organic produce for about five years and it ain't easy! Between the whitefly, viruses, bugs, aphids, mold, rain, heat, etc 

Looking for to following your project CB.

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Grapevines

Post by cypress on Fri May 11, 2018 4:48 pm

CanuckBob wrote:Thanks, I will check them out. Where exactly in SJC are they?

On the south side of the carretera. Coming from the east it is about 1/4 of the way through town. Lots of plants out front. He can get almost anything in but will it grow.

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Re: Grape vines

Post by dichosalocura on Fri May 11, 2018 4:57 pm

Mentioning muscadine grapes, another interesting and cool option would be to get a Brazilian Jaboticaba tree. I call mine my grape tree and it produces a black,grape like fruit that tastes very similar to a muscadine grape but they grow oddly up and down just the trunk and not on the branches like other fruit trees. The San Antonio nursery has them from time to time. There are a lot of recipes for making jaboticaba wine on google. I don't think you will have much plaga problems with this tree here. I planted mine from seed two years ago, so I am still waiting for mine to give fruit. I saw one medium sized one not long ago at the nursery in SA and it was covered in the black jaboticaba grapes. It is a very interesting looking tree!

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