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Head's up re: Monex

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Post by coffeeguy on Sun May 12, 2019 10:48 am

I only have personal experience (all good) with Multiva but friends in SMA have been affected by this. I think most folks here know to keep all or nearly all of their money in U.S. or Canadian accounts but just in case.


http://www.atencionsanmiguel.org/2019/04/26/thousands-of-dollars-have-disappeared-from-san-miguel-expat-accounts/

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Post by DaveP on Mon May 13, 2019 5:37 am

What connection does Monex have with Muliva? This is news to me.
Monex has had problems before. Money laundering? The fines were such they closed their Ajijic branch
Be careful
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Post by coffeeguy on Mon May 13, 2019 9:02 am

I don't know of any connection between Multiva and Monex and only posted the article in case anyone @ Lakeside still invested with Monex.

The article's a good cautionary tale on investing in Mexico altogher, IMHO. The expats who really got burned deposited huge sums of money, didn't read or speak enough Spanish to even communicate with the bank's staff let alone read the fine print, and didn't understand what they were investing in, while being greedy for 1-%+ returns. As with Bernie Madoff, if it sounds too good to be true it usually is.

Predictable too that the customer who did get some money back got it back at 12 pesos to the dollar. Currency arbitrage tends to wipe out most gains anyway over time, and that along with far stronger legal protections and FATCA reporting headaches are all very good reasons to keep most of not all of one's money NOB.

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Post by CanuckBob on Mon May 13, 2019 9:10 am

I don't nor will ever keep large sums of money in any Mexican institution.

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Post by gringal on Mon May 13, 2019 9:42 am

Me, either.  I have an account in a Mexican bank for convenience in getting cash, but anything substantial is NOB.  However, when the safe U.S. institutions are providing pitiful returns on money and a Mexican one offers a fine rate of interest, it is easy to see the temptation. IMO, they would be safer investing in some rental property in Mexico.  (That why it's called REAL estate.)

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Post by RVGRINGO on Mon May 13, 2019 10:36 am

I have always recommended keeping all of your banking in the USA or Canada. Online banking is so easy these days, and ATMs are everywhere in Mexico, so getting cash is quite convenient.

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Post by CanuckBob on Mon May 13, 2019 11:33 am

Yes sir. That's for sure.

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Post by Intercasa on Fri May 17, 2019 10:23 pm

Trust nobody with your money. Standards here are low, no training is required to work selling investments and the legal system is beyond broken. Most of the people working selling investments would not be able to work in other countries. Fraud and misrepresentation of rates of return is very common and many investments have a 30%+ tax withholding on gains, even long term ones so couple that with exchange rate risk and it not a good idea to put more than a few thousand in an account.
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Post by CanuckBob on Sat May 25, 2019 7:27 am


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Post by gringal on Sat May 25, 2019 8:30 am

If anyone has a problem with opening an account in the U.S. without going there in person or wants to use a Mexican address with the bank, have a credit card as well as an insured savings/checking account, start by googling "American Consumer Council 8 ".  

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Post by Trailrunner on Sat May 25, 2019 8:36 am

Wow. Amazing. 
This just confirms what Spencer said - "If a relatively low-level employee can go into your account, change your email address for notifications, change your password, redirect deposits, withdrawals, and wire transfers,” Karger says, “then you have a kindergarten-level security system safeguarding tens of millions of dollars.”
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Post by gringal on Sat May 25, 2019 8:46 am

Sounds like no security at all.

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Post by Trailrunner on Sat May 25, 2019 9:07 am

Yep, sure does.

We've also had problems here with Lloyd, when it was Lloyd, I personally know a Canadian couple who had 40,000 CAD disappear with a lengthy and expensive runaround for reimbursement. While perusing it they found 2 other victims.
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Post by ferret on Sat May 25, 2019 9:43 am

Not even 42% interest in 1996 gave us ANY inclination to put more than $5,000 Canadian in any Mexican bank. Be careful!
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Post by HoneyBee on Sat May 25, 2019 11:29 am

Well unfortunately I am one that put a lot of money in to a Mexican bank. Its bancomer banco patrimonial. They have no office in lakeside and if you have a question, the only way to get an answer is to go to their office in Guadalajara. My investments come to maturity next august (they have a five year term). Will be moving everything to Multivia whom come across as "honest".

But just in case, I bought seven small apartments........

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Post by CanuckBob on Sat May 25, 2019 11:41 am

Well it will be interesting to see how you make out since the peso has devalued so much in the past 5 years and that 30% withholding tax on any gain (in pesos).

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Post by HoneyBee on Sat May 25, 2019 11:49 am

Actually bob, you do not pay capital gain tax if you sell your primary home and its sold for under 4 million pesos. This process can be repeated every 3 years. But then again you may want to check this with Spencer. Yes the pesos has completely tanked. Luckily, my pension which is due next October is in SWISS francs.

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Post by CanuckBob on Sat May 25, 2019 12:39 pm

Im talking about your investments that come to maturity after you bought them 5 years ago. As for capital gains on real estate you can't claim any exemption on rental property. The exemption is up to $4,000,000 pesos per person on the title regardless of the selling price.

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Post by Intercasa on Sat May 25, 2019 3:52 pm

Yes, I hate all Mexican banks equally, they all screw clients, some people are too naive to see it and others pay with their life savings.

Bob is referring to ....

Assume you have $10,000 US, you invest it in Mexico with any of the unlicensed unvetted people working at companies who promise you a safe 8% return. You exchange your $10,000US to pesos at an exchange rate of 18 pesos the the dollar. So you now have an account with $180,000 pesos. Lets assume that someone got the 8% return at the end of the year and their money wasnt eaten up in fees, forced insurance, theft, siphoned, etc. So lets say 8% on $180,000 is $14,400 now they take off 30% withholding so you get $10,800 now having a balance of $190,800. Now the peso gets weak and is up to 21 pesos the the dollar. You now have $9,085 USD.
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Post by gringal on Sat May 25, 2019 4:07 pm

OUCH!!!

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Post by SunFan on Sat May 25, 2019 4:35 pm

Intercasa wrote:Assume you have $10,000 US, you invest it in Mexico with any of the unlicensed unvetted people working at companies who promise you a safe 8% return.  You exchange your $10,000US to pesos at an exchange rate of 18 pesos the the dollar.  So you now have an account with $180,000 pesos.  Lets assume that someone got the 8% return at the end of the year and their money wasnt eaten up in fees, forced insurance, theft, siphoned, etc.  So lets say 8% on $180,000 is $14,400 now they take off 30% withholding so you get $10,800 now having a balance of $190,800.  Now the peso gets weak and is up to 21 pesos the the dollar.  You now have $9,085 USD.  

Exactly the risk. So the wonderful 8% return doesn't pan out that well.

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Post by CanuckBob on Sat May 25, 2019 6:39 pm

And exactly why I only invest in real estate here. I would never bring any cash here. There are few regulations, even fewer charges brought against thieves and no insurance at all. If I were a rich Mexican I would keep all my money in the US or Canada. I think Carlos Slim lives in NY........

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Post by lotusflower on Sat May 25, 2019 7:13 pm

Security, seems to be the biggest problem here. It is extremely lax in Mexican banks. Personally don't keep any more than a few thousand at a time here.

A little light reading for you:

https://www.wired.com/story/mexico-bank-hack/

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Post by casi nada on Sat Jun 01, 2019 1:51 pm

Intercasa wrote:Yes, I hate all Mexican banks equally, they all screw clients, some people are too naive to see it and others pay with their life savings.  

Bob is referring to ....

Assume you have $10,000 US, you invest it in Mexico with any of the unlicensed unvetted people working at companies who promise you a safe 8% return.  You exchange your $10,000US to pesos at an exchange rate of 18 pesos the the dollar.  So you now have an account with $180,000 pesos.  Lets assume that someone got the 8% return at the end of the year and their money wasnt eaten up in fees, forced insurance, theft, siphoned, etc.  So lets say 8% on $180,000 is $14,400 now they take off 30% withholding so you get $10,800 now having a balance of $190,800.  Now the peso gets weak and is up to 21 pesos the the dollar.  You now have $9,085 USD.  

What are you talking about? Let's take 28 day CETES for example (currently paying about 8.02%). You invest $10,000 us at 18pesos. You have $180,000p in CETES. The tax rate on CETES (interest earned) is 1.04% for a net return of 6.8% or $12,240 pesos. Balance is now $192,240. As far as exchange rates go, let's turn your assumption around and say the peso gains strength to 16.5 to the dollar. So you now have $11,651 dollars for a return of about 8.6%. See how easy it is to make shit up.

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Post by gringal on Sat Jun 01, 2019 4:05 pm


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