In Chapala, Language barrier promotes corruption with authorities

Interesting article in Notisistema - http://www.notisistema.com/noticias/?p=494610

using google translate

The language barrier between foreigners who live in Chapala and Mexican authorities fosters corruption of police, prosecutors and staff of Roads, confirmed by the locals as Eduardo Lopez Ortega, who knows the stories of some affected.

"Because they see a American and although the American attempt to speak Spanish and do as much as possible, they grab your hand and petite money and so if you understand but if not, do not understand. I say this because here comes a guy who speaks much Spanish the other day stole his cell and said to him, bring a translator if you want. "

He says the only option for Americans and Canadians to stop abuse is to call a translator or Mexican friends to help them come to terms with the authority but not always available and must pay bribes to get the help they should be free. (By Victor Montes Renteria)

Only once in three years have the police tried to hit me up for mordita. With a broad grin on my face, I told the cops, "Lo siento, mi espanol es mal...no entiendo que dice." The cops laughed and sent me on my way.

Language barrier, that's some excuse. What will they think of next?

We lived here 11 years and only paid mordida twice.

ONLY twice? Only two felonies? Ha! Nice going.

johninajijic wrote:Language barrier, that's some excuse.

I agree John,mexicans get hit up for mordidas all the time,no language barrier there.In seven years of daily driving in GDL I've been pulled over numerous times,never gotten a ticket or paid a bribe,the one time I was actually guilty of the offense,lost in Tonala driving the wrong way on a one way street after talking to the transito he not only didn't give me a ticket but he gave me directions to where I was going.IMO the trick to dealing with cops be it NoB or SoB is to show respect but not fear.Worse comes to worse if they ask for 500 offer 50 and go from there.

David wrote:ONLY twice? Only two felonies? Ha! Nice going.

Using that logic maybe 80 to 90% of mexican drivers are felons.

Mad_Max wrote:Interesting article in Notisistema - http://www.notisistema.com/noticias/?p=494610

using google translate

The language barrier between foreigners who live in Chapala and Mexican authorities fosters corruption of police, prosecutors and staff of Roads, confirmed by the locals as Eduardo Lopez Ortega, who knows the stories of some affected.

"Because they see a American and although the American attempt to speak Spanish and do as much as possible, they grab your hand and petite money and so if you understand but if not, do not understand. I say this because here comes a guy who speaks much Spanish the other day stole his cell and said to him, bring a translator if you want. "

He says the only option for Americans and Canadians to stop abuse is to call a translator or Mexican friends to help them come to terms with the authority but not always available and must pay bribes to get the help they should be free. (By Victor Montes Renteria)

As one who maintains residences in both Lakeside and San Cristóbal de Las Casas, Chiapas where virtually no one speaks English and many speak little or no Spanish I will tell you that anyone who posits the above idiotic theory linking corruption to the number of foreigners living in a particular political jusrisdiction not conversant in the language of locals whether Spanish or Tsotzil or Greek is a moron of the highest order. Do not pontificate on matters with which you are unfamiliar. Jalisco is corrupt but Chiapas is far more corrupt so knock off the BS.

Bubba says
"As one who maintains residences in both Lakeside and San Cristóbal de Las Casas, Chiapas where virtually no one speaks English and many speak little or no Spanish I will tell you that anyone who posits the above idiotic theory linking corruption to the number of foreigners living in a particular political jusrisdiction not conversant in the language of locals whether Spanish or Tsotzil or Greek is a moron of the highest order. Do not pontificate on matters with which you are unfamiliar. Jalisco is corrupt but Chiapas is far more corrupt so knock off the BS."

So you are pointing out that there are more "Foreigners" in Chiapas than Jalisco.

arbon wrote:Bubba says
"As one who maintains residences in both Lakeside and San Cristóbal de Las Casas, Chiapas where virtually no one speaks English and many speak little or no Spanish I will tell you that anyone who posits the above idiotic theory linking corruption to the number of foreigners living in a particular political jusrisdiction not conversant in the language of locals whether Spanish or Tsotzil or Greek is a moron of the highest order. Do not pontificate on matters with which you are unfamiliar. Jalisco is corrupt but Chiapas is far more corrupt so knock off the BS."

So you are pointing out that there are more "Foreigners" in Chiapas than Jalisco.

Your point, Arbon? Do you have any notion of the character of either place?' I presume not.

Dawg

Arbon - Dawg should easily be able to answer your question. He knows there are a miniscule amount of NOB types in Chiapas.

[quote="johninajijic"]Arbon - Dawg should easily be able to answer your question. He knows there are a miniscule amount of NOB types in Chiapas.[/quote

Thank you for your support John but just as a point of clarification, San Cristóbal de Las Casas has a population of about 150,000 people about 40% of whom are indigenous Maya. Many indigenous Maya live in adjacent poor hillside favelas for complicated political and religious reasons I won´t go into here but will be happy to discuss that issue later when we return from Paris to Ajijic. I look forward to the discourse in which we can then engage.

Dawg

brigitte - I don't get your post, but I'll leave it at that. I don't know much about Chiapas other than a few of our friends went on a trip there and loved it. It sounded beautiful.

John:

That was Dawg posting, inadvertently. under Brigitte´s name. Obviously it was I as Brigitte is never that articulate. If you are ever in Chiapas you have an open invitation to coffee at the Dawghouse if we are around at the time.
Highland Chiapas is a fine and extraordinarily beautiful place


































Dawg

Dawg wrote:
As one who maintains residences in both Lakeside and San Cristóbal de Las Casas, Chiapas where virtually no one speaks English and many speak little or no Spanish I will tell you that anyone who posits the above idiotic theory linking corruption to the number of foreigners living in a particular political jusrisdiction not conversant in the language of locals whether Spanish or Tsotzil or Greek is a moron of the highest order. Do not pontificate on matters with which you are unfamiliar. Jalisco is corrupt but Chiapas is far more corrupt so knock off the BS. [/quote]

Boy do I agree with everything you said except for one thing.... I would have said " a moron of the lowest order"...assuming there is a "high" and "low" order of morons

Not buying this at all. Drive an old foreign plated junker, with no hubcaps and two Mexican street dogs sticking their heads out of the back window and I have never been stopped in over 7 years, no matter how hard I try. chico.

Chico wrote:Not buying this at all. Drive an old foreign plated junker, with no hubcaps and two Mexican street dogs sticking their heads out of the back window and I have never been stopped in over 7 years, no matter how hard I try. chico.

Doesn't matter Mexican plated or not. I've only been stopped twice in 11 years with expired Mass plates and I was at fault. So, I paid them off. 200 pesos each time. I had my friends car, stopped at the curb at the Airport and a Federale gave me/him an expensive ticket even though I had my Handicapped emblem hanging from the visor and I showed him my cane. Ticket was 550 pesos.

johninajijic wrote:

Chico wrote:Not buying this at all. Drive an old foreign plated junker, with no hubcaps and two Mexican street dogs sticking their heads out of the back window and I have never been stopped in over 7 years, no matter how hard I try. chico.

Doesn't matter Mexican plated or not. I've only been stopped twice in 11 years with expired Mass plates and I was at fault. So, I paid them off. 200 pesos each time. I had my friends car, stopped at the curb at the Airport and a Federale gave me/him an expensive ticket even though I had my Handicapped emblem hanging from the visor and I showed him my cane. Ticket was 550 pesos.

John, agree with you 100% that the license plate on the car does not matter. They stop whomever they see breaking the law. So many expats here with foreign license plates, feel they are being singled out by the police. I do not believe that at all and I see that you do not, either. Thanks for pointing out that at least one of the vehicles that you saw pulled over was Mexican plated. However, that does not ensure that it was a Mexican driver. Cannot tell you how over I am of the nonsensical cops picking on foreigners theme, that some expats toss around. The Canadian woman that got pulled over quite correctly, for wearing no seatbelts and screaming profanity at the Deputy Chief of Police and then three letters of apology about her behavior from fellow Canadians, is a landmark in terms of how not to conduct ourselves, in any situation here. chico

Yet my experiences were the very opposite. In 1997, I bought a used Mexican plated Nisan Tzuru (spelling). I drove all of the time and almost never was stopped.

Then in 2000 I purchased a spanking new, shiny, red, Texas plated, Ford Explorer 2dr. And I started getting stopped much more often. I don't get stopped as often now, because that same car has all kinds of scratches and dents it doesn't attract the eye of someone looking for money.

I also notice that when I do get stopped, I pay much less now, because I speak to the officers in Spanish, And that makes such a difference.

That's just my experience.

[quote="MexicoPete")

I also notice that when I do get stopped, I pay much less now, because I speak to the officers in Spanish, And that makes such a difference.

That's just my experience.[/quote]


Felicidades.

MexicoPete wrote:Yet my experiences were the very opposite. In 1997, I bought a used Mexican plated Nisan Tzuru (spelling). I drove all of the time and almost never was stopped.

Then in 2000 I purchased a spanking new, shiny, red, Texas plated, Ford Explorer 2dr. And I started getting stopped much more often. I don't get stopped as often now, because that same car has all kinds of scratches and dents it doesn't attract the eye of someone looking for money.

I also notice that when I do get stopped, I pay much less now, because I speak to the officers in Spanish, And that makes such a difference.

That's just my experience.

Pete, thank you for sharing your memories of 15 years ago. chico

We started driving in the greater Guadalajara/Lake Chapala area back in 1998 when we took a Chevrolet convertible with Oregon plates down there. That vehicle stayed at our Mexico house until 2005 when it was brought back to NM and was pulled over three times during one visit with Kathy driving (illegal U-turn, wrong way down a one way & too much merchandise in the back seat). Our mini van was pulled over twice in 2006 (illegal left turn going to Real Chapala & a drugs/weapons check going into Guadalajara) on its first Mexico trip with me driving. No tickets and no serious attempts at collecting mordida. If one stops to consider that in the time period spanning 13 years and somewhere in excess of 50,000 miles, we certainly have no reason to be leery of the cops in Mexico!

viajero wrote:[quote="MexicoPete")

I also notice that when I do get stopped, I pay much less now, because I speak to the officers in Spanish, And that makes such a difference.

That's just my experience.

Felicidades. [/quote]

My experience is that if you cannot speak a word of Spanish and act apologetic, you pay nothing and in their frustration let you go with no ticket and no mordita. chico

Chico posted "My experience is that if you cannot speak a word of Spanish and act apologetic, you pay nothing and in their frustration let you go with no ticket and no mordita. chico"

I've heard that from others too chico. Sadly some of the officers lakeside speak enough English to get around that, though.

There are predatory transitos here, for sure. It's just like anywhere else in Mexico, regardless of your plates (I drive both types of vehicles).

But paying "the bite" locally for a minor traffic infraction is a joke. That kind of bullshit is ridiculous. Demand the ticket. Call their bluff. When they threaten to impound your car--and they will--hand them the keys, say, "Take it, I'll pick it up tomorrow outside Chapala." It's just a crap argument (negotiation/fishing expedition) on their part.

And you can call a friend or take the bus back home, right? Don't be fooled.

But, if you've done something truly bad (property damage or worse).....well, that's different. Follow your conscious and do the right thing (by the people you've harmed).

I've only wiggled my way out via bribery twice in 20-something years of driving in Mexico. And those instances were in sketchy towns (TJ and outside Culiacan). Don't pay the local bozos trolling the carretera.

Absolutely agree, Rosa! These traffic stops that people are watching happen have little to do with traffic infractions or plates and everything to do with the predator cops trolling the carretera as Rosa says. You'll notice they all tend to be around this very mysterious, dangerous, unmarked, and arbitrary (probably intentionally) intersection of the carretera and the libremiento. It's a gold mine for them!