Not Great News out of Vallarta

"22 Carnival Cruise passengers robbed at gunpoint on ship-sponsored tour in Mexico"

http://overheadbin.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/02/24/10500812-22-carnival-cruise-passengers-robbed-at-gunpoint-on-ship-sponsored-tour-in-mexico

Now before you jump to the conclusion that it is just another NOB media report slamming Mexico, here is the report from INFORMADOR:

http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?hl=en&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&twu=1&u=http://www.informador.com.mx/jalisco/2012/359386/6/cruceristas-asaltados-en-el-nogalito-de-vallarta.htm&usg=ALkJrhiD_DzB1cC3_93OAMCcWlMCssBSMw

The blame game has started over this incident with the Mayor suggesting that Carnival should have hired private security while others are saying that it is up the City of Puerto Vallarta to provide adequate security:
http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?hl=en&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&twu=1&u=http://www.informador.com.mx/jalisco/2012/359553/6/faltaron-medidas-de-seguridad-en-caso-de-asalto-a-turistas.htm&usg=ALkJrhifCrGLxaTUyQhKDZA-v-1mA1-n1w

Just in time for spring break.
Chris

If Mexico wants to retain any of their tourist business they should show the world they are serious and quickly enact laws that doubles the penalties for crimes against foreigners. I believe in some Asian countries, crimes against tourists are punishable by death.

I respectfully disagree. By singling out crimes against tourists for special penalty, you are essentially creating an elite status. Toughen up the laws period and I can agree.

Yes, creating an elite status is exactly what I am suggesting and would prove to the world that they are very serious about their tourism industry. So far they have only proven to be good at trying to cover things up, arresting patsies and ducking or shifting blame.

CanuckBob wrote:Yes, creating an elite status is exactly what I am suggesting and would prove to the world that they are very serious about their tourism industry. So far they have only proven to be good at trying to cover things up, arresting patsies and ducking or shifting blame.

Is that all they have done so far? They got the guy that killed the gringo in Ajijic. They got the guys that killed the ICE agent in SLP. They got several that were involved in the killing in Melaque.


Screw any idea that differentiates victims because of their nationality. That was a big problem in this country's past. We don't need that shit agian.

Well regardless of what some recent reports may say, the tourism is going down the crapper. What do you suggest be done?

Stricter laws for "robberies" and "burglaries" against ANYONE by ANYONE. Start with the robberies because usually people are being threatened as well as robbed. Throw 'em in jail for a defined period of time with NO way of getting out until time is served. No deals whatsoever.
...and I mean that for EVERY country not just Mexico.

C Bob & CG,

Personally I think your both right. The crimes have singled out tourist so their needs a message sent that states “don’t mess with our economy”. However all crime perpetrators, no matter who their victims are should be shot on the spot. Any questions? (This should be for graffiti too.)

In principal I'm for the death penalty,some crimes merit nothing less, here or NoB,the problem I see with implementing it in Mexico is that the justice system here is so lacking in every sense of the word "justice" that you would end up with alot of innocents getting executed and the well connected walking as usual.I also believe that the punishment should be the same whether the victim is a tourist, a rico or a pobre.
When Porfirio Diaz heard that foreigners were reluctant to invest in Mexico because of all the bandrity in the country he created the Rurales who were pretty effective in bringing down the crime rate,but their tactics were rather extreme.I recommend the documentary"Presunto Culpable"for those interested in seeing how the "justice system"works here.
Chris

Unfortunately, I don't think the criminals have singled out tourists. You're hearing about the tourists through the media of outrage.
What kind of a message does it send to hard working Mexican families (who also get robbed and intimidated but you don't read about it on the front page) who do their best to make ends meet? It says "Don't be a good hard working citizen, it's easier to rob people".
A nasty, slippery slope.

Parker wrote:C Bob & CG,

Personally I think your both right. The crimes have singled out tourist so their needs a message sent that states “don’t mess with our economy”. However all crime perpetrators, no matter who their victims are should be shot on the spot. Any questions? (This should be for graffiti too.)

Execute kids with spray paint,would that be for first time offenders or just repeat offenders?What an idiotic post,why don't you move to China where they know how to deal with hooligans,you brain dead old fart.
Chris

Parker wrote:C Bob & CG,

Personally I think your both right. The crimes have singled out tourist so their needs a message sent that states “don’t mess with our economy”. However all crime perpetrators, no matter who their victims are should be shot on the spot. Any questions? (This should be for graffiti too.)

Oh boy! wouldn't this be a sight, Parker and Dan the man executing the BAD BAD graffiti people. Hell we could set hours and sell tickets.

Speaking of brain dead. . . .

Real intelligent post there, Marty. Want to share with the rest of us when and where I ever suggested that?

BTW, for the ignoramuses here, the serious taggers aren't "kids." They are for the most part hardened gang members in their late teens and twenties. A lot of street criminal and narco involvement in tagging. I'd suggest that some of you look it up but it's pretty clear from the level of knowledge in your postings, you don't know how to.

We'll never have to worry about fat boy Marty getting off his ass and doing anything for the community, that's for sure.

Sorry for the jump to conclusion there Dan, but with your attitude and political leaning I just assumed you would be in lockstep with Parker on this one. As an aside what I do for my community is between myself and my community, and I feel no need to broadcast the fact. Alltho I can understand why some may have to inflate ther ego evert now nnd then.

While I don't believe in the death penalty, cutting off hands of thieves or some of the other archaic punishment systems, the fact remains that harsh penalties are only a deterrent if those inclined to commit crimes believe that will be their punishment if caught. I would venture a guess that it will be a long time in coming before that would be the case in Mexico. Could you just imagine the "bad boys" in the US or Canada willingness to parade in front of a press conference and confessing their sins?

Well I certainly don't have the answers but it is pisses me off to see Mexico's tourist industry in such a decline. I understand that it may not be the solution to have separate penalties for tourists vs citizens but something sure needs to be done and fast. Reputations are quick to tarnish but very hard to get back........

I wonder what the millions of Mexicans reliant on the tourist industry think should be done?

Nobody cares, really it sucks, either they feel it doesn't concern them or their family are criminals, period!

Intercasa wrote:Nobody cares, really it sucks, either they feel it doesn't concern them or their family are criminals, period!

I'm assuming that you are asking people who are local here? Wonder what the local's in Puerto Vallarta and environs think.

It is apathy all over, nobody likes it but nothing is being done, rich blame poor and vice versa and politicians blame each other.

Ahhh! Just like Canada and the U.S.

parker was always fullofsxxt. hello? parker & all that phony liberal compassion b.s. please, i can spot them a mile a way. thats the poster who was seeking hurricane victims to "help". & wondered why the poor mexicans dont invite him/her to their homes. then there was a dialogue about protein bars. (this was part of the "maid woes" thread. i saved much of that for material. it was precious, could not make this stuff up). this is why the world hates these white phonies. i had "parkers" number way back, this was the first person to trash me, said i had no heart. fxxk you too). next thing we will hear is that we do not understand the "humor"- it was satire. ("shot on the spot", very funny). moving on: i see both sides, CB & CG. death penalty here would not work. but theres nothing wrong w/a double whammy for tourists/vistors. especially americans & canadians. why? the US bends over backwards to accomodate mexicans. its a 2 way street. lets face it, its all about $. both governments understand THAT one. life is not always fair, maybe it can be 1/2 fair. @least some criminals will be put away. & these people rob mexicans as well, so it helps across the board. i am w/CB.

martygraw wrote:Sorry for the jump to conclusion there Dan, but with your attitude and political leaning I just assumed you would be in lockstep with Parker on this one. As an aside what I do for my community is between myself and my community, and I feel no need to broadcast the fact. Alltho I can understand why some may have to inflate ther ego evert now nnd then.

I see that once again the really ignorant jump on the irrational instead of thinking rational. Of course you don’t go about shooting everyone but things need to change. The saying “Stupid is someone that continues to do the same thing over and over and expects different results.”

susan wrote:parker was always fullofsxxt. hello? parker & all that phony liberal compassion b.s. please, i can spot them a mile a way. thats the poster who was seeking hurricane victims to "help". & wondered why the poor mexicans dont invite him/her to their homes. then there was a dialogue about protein bars. (this was part of the "maid woes" thread. i saved much of that for material. it was precious, could not make this stuff up). this is why the world hates these white phonies. i had "parkers" number way back, this was the first person to trash me, said i had no heart. fxxk you too). next thing we will hear is that we do not understand the "humor"- it was satire. ("shot on the spot", very funny). moving on: i see both sides, CB & CG. death penalty here would not work. but theres nothing wrong w/a double whammy for tourists/vistors. especially americans & canadians. why? the US bends over backwards to accomodate mexicans. its a 2 way street. lets face it, its all about $. both governments understand THAT one. life is not always fair, maybe it can be 1/2 fair. @least some criminals will be put away. & these people rob mexicans as well, so it helps across the board. i am w/CB.

Please show me, since you have copies at hand, dates etc. so we can verify.